How to Attract More Clients Through Effective Storytelling

The Imperfectly Ambitious Podcast, with Amanda Edwards and Kris Jones

Speaker 1 (00:00):

Hello friends. Welcome back to another episode of

Imperfectly Ambitious. Alright, in today's episode, I'm talking with Chris

Jones and we're talking about storytelling, and she's going to bring in her

shortcut to the StoryBrand framework, and we're going to talk through how to

incorporate storytelling, how to incorporate some of these fundamentals of

storytelling into your business so that you can leverage the power of it, you

can increase your connection with your audience, connection with your clients,

really gain more leverage in your results and grow your business as a result of

this effective storytelling. Because I think that so many times we hear about

story, the power of story, and that we should be bringing more story into our

content or our copy or marketing materials, but it's like, okay, then you're

wondering how to actually do that. And when we think of a story, we often think

of ourselves and telling our own story.

Speaker 1 (01:01):

The key thing here, the key aha moment in this episode is

the story isn't actually about you. This type of story that we're talking about

that's actually going to cause you to create a connection, see more results,

get better responses and just see growth in your business and in your

connections is storytelling. That's about them. So how to do that is what we're

talking about today. And she actually, we go through things that you can start

doing. We actually show you what that looks like, and she talks through that in

this shortcutted StoryBrand framework that she has that really simplifies

things. So tune in, I know you'll enjoy. Welcome to Imperfectly Ambitious. This

is your go-to podcast. If you're an ambitious achiever, checking all of the

boxes, but know that there's more for you, more impact you know can make on

your terms. Join us each week for inspiration, tools and business mentorship to

help you break through what's holding you back and take imperfect action one

step at a time as you create more impact, putting your gifts to work and doing

more of what you love.

Speaker 1 (02:14):

I'm Amanda Edwards and I'm so glad you're here. If you are

desperately wanting to feel more authentic and feel more natural when you're

selling, I've created an audio training with a workbook for you to really help

you connect with your current and future clients. And it's a series of ideas

that you can use to plant seed with them and connect more deeply in all of your

communications, whether that's social media content, email your conversations

and you'll do this and you'll nurture them and connect with them before you

even sell anything so that you're not going from not communicating to all of a

sudden you have something to sell, but they're not ready yet. And so that's

what series of ideas is for. It's going to prepare your clients for your offer

and the next steps to work with you. And even if you don't have the offer to

sell yet or you're really working up a new one, don't wait to show up. Now is

when you can really be connecting with people and laying the foundation. And so

that's what this training is going to help you do. You can grab it at the link

in the episode description. I hope you enjoy, Chris. Hello. It is so great to

have you on the show. I'm excited about this topic and so thank you for being

here.

Speaker 2 (03:28):

Thank you so much for having me. I'm really happy to be

here.

Speaker 1 (03:32):

Yeah, absolutely. Well, let's dive in. Tell us a little

bit about what you do and kind of just the background about how you help your

clients.

Speaker 2 (03:41):

So I help entrepreneurs, mostly service-based

entrepreneurs, really get their website copied, dialed in. The people that I

work with are just, they're very busy and they do not have time to write their

own website and they don't have time to learn about how to write their website.

So my process gets the whole website copy thing dialed in, gets you telling a

story that truly connects and sells for you in two and a half hours flat. I

love it. And my background is really around, I started out in graphic design

about 20 years ago, and as time evolved and websites became more and more

important, I got into that and I kind of started out believing that if you had

a beautiful website design, that was all you really needed. And then time

continues on and we start to really learn that it's more about the messaging

than it is about the design. At the beginning of the web era, you used to

really be able to get away with a great design and not have to say much. And so

it's evolved now. I really feel like copy is king. You've got to be telling a

story, you've got to be connecting with your audience, and then the design is

really secondary. It's there to really support your message.

Speaker 1 (05:19):

Yeah, I love it. So true. We were talking about this the

other day actually, just that concept in general. And my heart is in messaging,

positioning, and sales for women in business. And we were talking a little bit

before recording just about, I really, it's helping create that feeling of

authenticity, that feeling of enthusiasm and excitement and being connected to

that meaning behind what you're doing and that drive for why you're doing it in

the first place and showing up and having these conversations in a very real

way instead of that just where you feel like something's off or you're worried

about being offputting and you're not feeling like you're in alignment, feels

forced, all these things. And I love it because I think this is so much in

alignment with that. And so I'm really interested today in talking through with

you in particular this story brand framework.

Speaker 1 (06:13):

I love that and how you really incorporate that into your

work around helping people create their story. Because when we were talking

before recording too, I was saying that it's like we all fundamentally that you

should start incorporating more story into your messaging and into your

conversations. But I think people get stuck, and I want you to comment on this,

but I think people get stuck on what that looks like. What do I do? Do I just

go out there and all of a sudden just tell a story or you always hear about

your kind of origin story or a brand story? Is that it? Do I just go one time

and tell that? And then I mean people have a hard time kind of piecing it

together as far as what does that look like as an overall strategy, as an

overall ongoing part of your business versus it's not just one story. So maybe

if you could comment on that, walk us through that a little bit.

Speaker 2 (07:13):

It gets really confusing because I mean, no one can argue

that you've got to be telling a story in your marketing and on your website,

but even people that read books like Building a StoryBrand, which is an

extraordinary book, kind of breaking down the components of story, there are a

handful of them out there, but even when you educate yourself, it's still hard.

It's still hard to go, okay, I understand the concept of story, but where do I

begin on this blank piece of paper? And we've all grown up listening to or

reading stories, getting stories read to us. And so I think automatically our

brains go to okay, once upon a time or is it a once upon a time story? Is it a

brand story? It about me? Who am I talking about? It's really challenging to

figure out. So I think the most important thing to remember is that your story

isn't actually about you.

Speaker 2 (08:24):

And for a lot of business owners, this is such a relief

because people sit down at the computer and they're like, oh, I got to write

about myself. I got to write about all the history of my working career. And it

starts to feel like a resume or maybe even kind of braggy or whatever, just it

might feel contrived, all the things. It just doesn't feel good. And so I love

talking about story because it's such a relief for most people when you're

like, oh yeah, your story is actually not about you. The key is really diving

into who your ideal client is and articulating really clearly what their

problem is. And I'm just going to repeat that because it's actually worth

writing down. So clearly articulating what your ideal customers are struggling

with. And I bet you can do that in one or two minutes because you've heard it

time and time and time again.

Speaker 2 (09:27):

When you get on your calls with them, they're struggling,

they want to overcome a hurdle and they're frustrated or overwhelmed or however

they articulate the problem. That's really what you want to hone in on because

the reality is every story begins with a problem. And what's really cool is

that when we can really think about this, we can really think about

storytelling in the way we go to a movie. So I might go to a movie this

afternoon, I go in and somehow magically with all the things going on in my life

and all the messages coming in on my phone, I can forget about everything for

nearly two hours. Nothing has the power to do that in this day and age other

than storytelling. And that's the power of story. And when you think about the

last movie you went to, I guarantee it started with a hero who had a problem.

Speaker 2 (10:30):

And that's how you're going to start your story too. And

it really is as simple as articulating that problem that they're going through.

So then about 20 minutes into every movie or every book enters in the guide and

you are the guide to this story. So if we're talking about Karate Kid, you are

Mr. Miyagi. If we're talking about Star Wars, you are Yoda. And so that's the

beautiful thing is that you are a character in your story, you're inviting your

customers and your clients into a story with you, but you don't have to be the

hero. And one of the biggest mistakes that I see happen is guides. IE, the

business owner paints themselves as the hero. And the thing about this is two

important things. There's only room for one hero in every story. So when you're

the hero of your own story on your website, you are immediately kicking your

potential client out of the story. And secondly, the hero is the weakest

character in the story. The guide is the strongest character in the story. The

guide has been there, done that, and can show the hero the way to success. So

there's a lot of reasons we don't want to be the hero of our own story, but

those are a couple of them.

Speaker 1 (12:10):

Yeah, that's so good. And I want to comment before you go

on, I know we have the hero, the problem, the guide, and I know there's more to

follow, but real quick, I think that I love what you're saying there because

you're talking about painting that picture, and I think whether it's a website

or whether I see it a lot when I talk about messaging and any sort of content,

even in a podcast episode when I'm talking to somebody about their podcast

content or whether it's an email or something, when you hear something or you

read something where somebody is even unintentionally, but they're positioning

themselves as the hero and making it all about them. And I love how you said

then there's no room for another hero. There's no room. The person on the other

end has now checked out because they don't understand what's in it for them.

Speaker 1 (13:02):

They're now, this is not, I'm going to go onto the next

email, I'm going to click to the next podcast episode. I don't need to hear

about what's in it for me. How can I identify with this? How do I know that you

understand what I'm dealing with and that are you the one who I actually trust

to either give me the information, take my hand to walk me through it, whatever

it is. So I love that you brought that up. And another thing when you were

talking about the key is really taking your ideal client and articulating what

they're struggling with. Do you find, I think it was key, like you said, that

you need to take their words and use their words because I think sometimes as

an expert in something or because you've been there, you've done that, you've

had the experiences, you're now using this different language that they don't

identify with yet, and they're like, well, that you're using either industry

jargon or you're using some sort of acronym that they are not aware of yet, or

you're jumping 10 steps ahead of where they are right now. And so I think it is

key, like you said, I love using their words as you're telling the story.

Speaker 2 (14:16):

Yeah, it's pretty mind blowing. There's a lot of

psychology that happens too when you begin by articulating your customer's

problem. Our brains are constantly scanning the environment to figure out how

we're going to survive and thrive. And a big way we do that is we try and

figure out how to solve our own problems. We're problem solving machines

basically. And so when someone articulates our problem really clearly, we

automatically make this assumption. It's like magic. We automatically make this

assumption that that person is the best one to solve the problem for me. So

there's a bunch of cool things that happen. The other thing is when you begin

with a problem, you open up a story loop and human nature, just because we sat

around the fireside at the beginning of time telling stories, we are so wired

for stories. So what the problem does is it opens up a story loop that our

brains find a hundred percent irresistible. And so we can't help but engage. We

can't help but keep scrolling or keep reading because we have to find out if

that problem's going to get solved.

Speaker 1 (15:38):

Yeah, so interesting. Okay, you have the hero, the

problem, the guide. Continue to walk us through that.

Speaker 2 (15:43):

Sure. Yeah. You are the guide that is of the utmost

importance. You are the guide and you become a guide through empathy and

authority, and you become a guide by making sure your communications are really

always centered around the hero. But one of the two most important things that

the guide does is he gives the hero a plan. He or she gives the hero a plan to

show them how if they follow that plan, they can reach success. And it doesn't

have to be a complicated plan. A lot of times for my clients, the plan is

schedule a call, get a customized estimate or get a custom roadmap and then

experience this success. The third part of the plan is always that happy end

result that you're going to reach. And so the plan is really an important part

of stepping in as a leader.

Speaker 2 (16:43):

The hero wants to know what they need to do, what they can

do next, tell me what to do. And so giving them that plan coupled with a really

clear actionable call to action will set you up as the guide and it'll just

reinforce the safety and the comfort that you're providing for the hero. The

other important thing that every guide does is they paint a picture of what

success looks like. And this kind of echoes back to your comment about what's

in it for me? How am I going to benefit from this engagement? How am I going to

succeed? How am I going to reach my goal? How am I going to feel? What's my

life going to look like? And so we really want to clearly also clearly

articulate that. What are the benefits of this? Are you going to find financial

peace of mind if I'm a retirement planner, you might talk about financial peace

of mind.

Speaker 2 (17:47):

If I'm a chiropractor, I talk about hike all the mountains

that you want to hike or what adventures that you want to go on. So really

painting a picture of that verbally and also with your visuals. I think that

this is where great photography can come into play is really showing those

emotions that people are going to feel when they have peace of mind or they

feel fit and trim or whatever. They're going to feel like that emotion is kind

of where we make decisions. So we think that we make decisions based on data

and facts, but we really make them based on emotions so that painting that

picture of success can be a great way to tap into emotion for people.

Speaker 1 (18:40):

I agree. I so agree. And I think there are some people

I've heard will argue like, Nope, you make the decisions based on facts. You

make the decisions based on data. There are maybe things in business where

that's true, but in my world, the same realm where you're talking about sales

as humans, you make decisions on emotions, period. You do period. Again, you

can be intent, period. And so I think people don't want to hear that because it

feels like there's data, there are facts, there's other things again that will

maybe drive some certain decisions in your life or in your business that you're

being very intentional about looking at a piece of data or whatever. But in

general, we are emotional beings and that's how people, you need to connect

with that.

Speaker 2 (19:32):

Definitely. I think a lot of times, I mean so much of this

happens subconsciously, so we might make that decision emotionally in our body,

but then we're going to go find the facts and the data to support the decision

that we've already kind of fundamentally made.

Speaker 1 (19:51):

Exactly. I love that. That is so true. Such a key little

caveat there. That's very, very true because you'll find what you look for,

you'll find any data to support what you've already made up in your mind to be

true. Right, exactly. If you're looking for it. So true. One thing I want to

circle back on, I think it's powerful, and I'll give somebody a tangible

example because what I see a lot in the messaging world too is I love your

example of the hiking. Go on all the hikes you want for a chiropractor. That

message right there is very different than come and get your back in alignment.

Well, that's what, sure. That's what's ultimately going to happen in order to

allow the person who loves hiking, who hasn't been able to go hiking in three

years and they're in constant pain and they can only walk for a couple blocks

before they have to just sit down because their back's hurting, they don't know

that that solution yet is getting their back into alignment or I'm

oversimplifying, but whatever the chiropractor's going to do.

Speaker 1 (20:58):

So you have to speak to in their mind what the problem is,

not what the problem is. It's the symptom that they're experiencing as a result

of the problem, their symptom that's causing them pain. Yeah, it's the back,

but really why that's a pain is because they can't go on the dang hikes. That's

speaking to what's important to them. I just wanted to highlight that you

brought that up and that is something I hear about a lot or I get in

conversations a lot about when it comes to selling and positioning programs and

services and products, and that comes up a lot on the messaging piece.

Speaker 2 (21:34):

I think a great way to filter that. I find myself

reminding people of that quite a bit when I'm talking about the same thing, and

I define that as you really want to tell them what they get, not the how they

get it. So what they get is they get to go hiking again. How they get it is

they get their back in alignment again. And it's not that they don't care about

how at all, but we really want to double down on that, what they get, what is

that happy end result? And don't get caught up in too many of the details.

They're going to trust that you know how to get 'em there.

Speaker 1 (22:14):

Do you see, I am curious your thoughts. Do you see people

who get caught up in the details or focusing more on the features of whatever

it is that they're offering, their service, their product, their program? Do

you see them getting so caught up in these features because they think that

they have to sell all of the things that are included, like the 25 modules, the

25 templates, the five live call, all the things listed out because they feel

like I've better provide enough of the stuff in order for it to be desirable.

Speaker 2 (22:54):

Right? Oh my God.

Speaker 1 (22:56):

Instead of actually, if you had a statement about, to your

point, what the actual result would be for somebody, they're much more that you

could have one statement about that versus 25 bullets. It's going to be a lot

more effective.

Speaker 2 (23:12):

Absolutely. And put the lead at more ease. I know when I

am on a website and I'm interested in the end result, and then I look at all

the features and the bonuses and I am like, oh, I don't have time. This is very

overwhelming. And I've had experiences too just with clients who really want to

push the features a lot. And again, it's not that you don't need any features,

but you really want to just be very aware of not to overwhelm people with

information. And I think a lot of times people talk about features versus

benefits. They're very, very different. Very, very different things. The

benefit is hero focused, and the feature is really positioning you as more of

the hero.

Speaker 1 (24:11):

Totally. And that's just again, flat out that's what it

is. And I don't think people realize that. So hopefully this helps to bring

some of that awareness and maybe shifting some things, making some minor

tweaks. I'm curious, where do you think that comes? I mean, you see it all the

time, and I don't know if it's just an old school, kind of the marketing, I

don't know. You just see that all the time or with you, and you have to think,

what do you like to consume? What catches your attention? What really causes

you to connect? But when I see a website that's listing off all these things,

all these bullet points, but if you do this, it's this bonus and then this

bonus later then. But if you choose to do this two months from now, I can't,

lost me. Not even if I was interested. I'm not now because this is causing me

to think too much and piece it all together.

Speaker 2 (25:08):

Right. And that's such a good point because our brains are

inundated with information. This is the world we live in. We've got information

coming in from every angle, and we're really wired and our brains are even

wired to really conserve calories. And so if you create a website that is

causing the reader to burn too many calories to digest that information, they

will bail biologically. They will bail. They won't even really know why. It's

just like, this is taking too much of my energy to digest and I have to

conserve because I have to survive. So I think that comes, I don't know. I

think that that might come from maybe the way things used to be done, but my

sense is that it comes from a couple things. Number one, people are really

excited about what they're doing, and often they're just really generous at

heart and wanting to share all the goodies and all the bonuses and all the

value that they're willing to give, which is such a beautiful thing, but not

always effective. And then I think I see it happening too with business owners

that are maybe a little bit insecure about their offer. They're not really

owning the transformation that they provide, and so they kind of fill up the

gaps with features and benefits rather than, or features rather than benefits.

Speaker 1 (26:47):

Yeah. So good. Can you talk to us a little bit about, you

talked about the guide and then how you become a guide is really through that

empathy and authority, and I love that. I want you to speak to that a little

bit. When you say empathy and authority, how does that show up?

Speaker 2 (27:06):

Yeah, so the beautiful thing is, I just want to make a

quick point here before I forget it, is once you get your story dialed in, you

do not have to redo it. You can echo this story again and again. It'll be on

your website, on your social media, on all your marketing materials. But I

wanted to share that because if you go through the process, you really

articulate that problem and showing empathy is really picking one of those

biggest problems that you've articulated and just saying, I know when you're

in, we're going back to the chiropractor again. When you're in physical pain,

it's hard to feel your best. And maybe one of the problems that they're coming

to them with is, I just don't feel my best. I feel like the cranky version of

me, I'm in pain all the time. My legs are cramped up. And so it's just really,

it's that simple. It's really hard when your back is out and you're not feeling

your best or writing your own website copy can feel really overwhelming. That

is empathy right there. It's just kind of echoing the problem, but from a place

of, I get it. I use, I get it a lot. I get it. This is hard.

Speaker 1 (28:32):

Which helps somebody identify with you or identify with

the fact that you understand me, you're understanding how I'm feeling. You get

me, I'm listening now. Maybe you're the one that I resonate with or that I

trust to work with because you are understanding my problem and you're

vocalizing that,

Speaker 2 (28:51):

Right? And you are the one that can help me work through

this. Because either you've done it or you've helped a lot of other people do

it.

Speaker 1 (29:00):

Yeah. Do you want to talk about authority a little bit?

Speaker 2 (29:02):

Yeah. Authority is really also very easy. I mean, the

beautiful thing about this is just when you really break it down, it's all

quite simple. So authority is really just sharing the qualifications that you

have. You only need about three. I would say pick two or three things, and it

might be, I like to use numbers for authority. So it might be like eight years

in business. And then you might want to count up on average if you're a coach

on average, have you coached 10 people a year? So you might say, okay, on

average I've coached 80 people or 10 people a year over eight years, over 80

happy clients. So that might be another bit of authority. You might show that

you're certified as a coach by some bigger coach, like life coach school or

something like that. So you can show us certification.

Speaker 2 (30:11):

Another great way to show your authority is through

testimonials, and that's a whole another episode. But again, now that you're

kind of understanding the fundamentals of story testimonials, follow that same

rhythm you want to talk about. When you gather testimonials from your clients,

you ask them, what was the problem that you were experiencing before you hired

me? And then what was the happy end result that you experienced through working

with me? What were some of the successes that you experienced? And then really

that right there, that contrast shows the transformation that you created for

them. So in a way, the testimonials are also kind of a mini story in and of

themselves. And one of the key things about testimonials is you don't want to

silo them out on their own page because they're so powerful, they're so

effective. They do so much heavy lifting for you that a lot of people put them

on another page. And then if I don't make it to that page, I've missed all your

powerful testimonials. So I think it's really important to weave about three

testimonials, make sure they speak to the transformation that you provide and

the problem that was overcome on your homepage.

Speaker 1 (31:42):

Yeah. Yeah. So good, so valuable. What else did we not

touch on that you want to be sure and leave us with before we sign off?

Speaker 2 (31:53):

I think the biggest thing, I mean, I think we've really

hit hard on starting with the problem, but what I want to remind your audience

is that this works for everything. If you are about to do a social media post,

start with the problem. If you're going to be interviewed on a podcast, start

with the problem that you solve. If you're filling out your LinkedIn profile or

your Instagram profile, start with the problem and then make sure you show that

your service is the solution that will bring them to success. And really, those

are the fundamentals of story. And as long as you position yourself as the

guide and them as the hero, you're golden. And then the other thing is a story

doesn't have to be very long. It can be two or three sentences.

Speaker 1 (32:51):

Yeah. Yeah. I love it. I love it. Love it. Thank you. And

I think the key thing here, I hope such an aha moment for people listening is

that the story actually isn't about you at all. There are going to be times

sure where you go in and you talk about your brand story, you talk about all

the other stories that you hear about, but the most important story that is

going to help you connect with the people who you're there to serve, that's

help you connect at another level and who is going to say, yes, this is who I

want to work with because they understand me, is this type of a story. It's not

actually about you at all. And so I think it's so powerful. I appreciate you

coming on, Chris.

Speaker 2 (33:34):

I'm so happy I got to come. Yeah, thank you. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (33:37):

Where can people find you and connect with you if they

want to learn more?

Speaker 2 (33:41):

Yeah, so my copy that sells in 2.5 hours flat program

is@grow.red door designs.com. That's grow.red door with two ds and designs with

an S on the end.com. And you can find out all about what I offer there, and if

you go to red door designs.com, you'll find some freebies and some free

resources as well.

Speaker 1 (34:08):

Awesome. Thank you so much for being here. We'll talk to

you soon.

Speaker 2 (34:11):

Okay, thanks.

Speaker 1 (34:12):

If you love this episode, I would love to hear from you,

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